Ted Leo is a
great guy. I
don't really even know him that well, and I consider him a good
friend. We only met for the first time this past May.
Ted Leo and his band, Rx/Pharmacists, were on a long U.S. tour
with fellow D.C. band Q and Not U. The package was
stopping off to play a show and, having known the fellows in Q
and Not U for a while, I invited them to stay at my place.
It was a tight squeeze - ten people plus the three permanent
residents, and our cat, Scout, but somehow we all managed to fit
in comfortably after the show. The show itself was
amazing, it being my first live encounter with Ted Leo. He
began his set solo, playing a couple of hard rocking numbers,
his voice backed only by his lone guitar, and quickly drew the
crowd in with his honesty, disarming them with eye contact and
completely engaging them with his delivery. After a few
invigorating numbers his full backing band joined in, giving his
performance even more punch. It was inspiring to see how
full and immediate a solo voice can sound with only an electric
guitar backing it, and be even more potent with a full band.
A few months later Leo and the Pharmacists were on the road
again, this time with my friend Arlie and his amazing band Juno.
I contacted Ted Leo while on the road, asking to do an interview
for an upcoming edition of Copper
Press, and he said he'd be delighted. Why didn't they
crash at my place again and we could do it the next day? Perfect.
Once again Leo began his set with a few songs on
his own before being augmented by the full band. Once
again he immediately connected with the audience, their
positions relative him and the stage quickly coming together.
He drew the audience in, not only emotionally but physically as
well, his soulful delivery making even his blaring guitar
personal and intimate. His latest album, The Tyranny of
Distance, was released on the Lookout! label earlier in 2001
and by the time of his stop at my place in the fall, it was in
the middle of a national groundswell of support. Things
were finally coming together for Leo, an artist that had gone
from spotlight to obscurity and back again in the blink of an
eye.
After the show we went for burritos and talked about how things
had been and how they were going. While inside, the rear
license plate was stolen from the Leo/Pharmacists tour wagon, a
large dark-colored Dodge van. The van, belonging to Leo's
father and acquiring heavy mileage by doing double duty as tour
transport for both Ted and his brother Chris Leo and his band,
the Lapse, was a bit dented and scraped, but was in otherwise
top shape. It was depressing for everyone when the plates
were stolen, for whatever reason. The next day, after Ted
had done his laundry and accidentally washed my favorite pillow,
we went to the police station to file a report. My pillow
was old, and had cloth stuffing, so I had to have it refilled by
my mom. I didn't mind at all, however, because after the
interview for Copper Press I arranged the following interview
for Lost At Sea. As you will see, by the time the
interview was finished I had grown to appreciate Ted Leo and his
music more than I already had. Yes, Ted Leo is a great
guy.
So, Ted. Do you like doing interviews?
Well, usually I don't mind. I like to think that there is a lot
about our music, a lot that is going on that more often than not
isn't necessarily easy for me to define. But doing interviews I
get to think it out. It helps me get my ideas together.
Do you do a lot of email interviews? Because that is
when you have plenty of time to prepare your answers and you're
never really "on the spot".
Right. Yeah. And no one ever says, "This interview was done
by email", so you end up looking like some great, off the
cuff, really articulate guy.
So what do you think about the new record? How did that all
come together?
I guess there are a few of the songs that I'd been playing by
myself live for a month or two before recording, but none of it
was really fleshed out in that I hadn't had the chance to try
out different ideas. No extra guitars or strings or anything
like that. It wasn't until I had a finished product in my hands,
with the artwork and everything, that it hit me, and then I was
really pleased.
Is the artwork something you consider a complete part of an
album, equal to the music, or is it just packaging?
It's definitely not something that I would consider just
packaging. Since I started doing solo records, obviously I've
had complete control of the artwork and stuff, and I've actually
somewhat consciously tried to have an extended aesthetic through
all the releases that I've done. It didn't start out that way,
but I've really had these stark, graphic images. It isn't
something that I feel is necessarily necessary as part of a
record, in that I think the artwork rarely detracts from a
record but I think that it can really enhance a record. With
that in mind, each of the three records that I've done under my
own name, as well as some of the 7"s, the artwork is really
very much a part of the piece. The colors and everything are
part of it.
So last night you had your license plate stolen. Is that the
only vandalism you've ever been subjected to?
Well, not in my life, no. I've had houses and cars broken into.
But on tour, definitely, the license
plate is the only thing. Wait, that's not true. I was on
tour with Chisel, my old band, in Pittsburgh our van was broken
into and all of our suitcases were stolen. Our gear was all
inside the bar. But it was one of those things, because the next
day we all went to this one Am Vets thrift shop in Pittsburgh
and I've gotten some of the most amazing clothes. There are two
suits that I got from there that are the best fitting $5 suits
I've ever had.
Well, I guess you've gotten off pretty well, as many miles as
you've logged, only having your license plate stolen. And the
suits were a blessing in disguise then.
Yeah, definitely.
I've been going through this thing lately where I'll spend
the entire day in such an inefficient manner that I only get a
few things done the whole day, and it has really started to piss
me off. I feel almost like I'm wasting my life, in terms of
getting things done. I get so frustrated, and I wonder if other
people feel that way. I wonder if other people are making
efficient use of their lives.
That is the question. I mean, I always think about that,
especially being someone who I think has a pretty wide area of
interests, and being somewhat politically or activist minded. I
start to think of the life of being "a musician" and
that it pretty much consumes your life to the detriment of other
things you might want to pursue. It is a very wasteful
lifestyle. You're burning all this gas driving all over the
country, using all of these petroleum products in what people
will listen to the music on, using a lot of paper and plastics
in the packaging. There are definite questions I have about it.
It was a definite conceptual hurdle for me to get over, but a
year or two ago I came to terms with the fact that I could do a
lot of things, and I could be into a lot of other things, but I
feel like I have a vocation to do this. This is what I do best
and while me and / me and my band aren't huge, but there have
been enough people that have responded in the way that is the
reason that I got into punk rock in the first place. In that I
appreciate you helping my life in some way response. So,
yeah, I may not be doing all of this other stuff but that is how
I'm contributing. Like, I do kind of believe in Dharma and that
sort of thing. Like I have a friend who is a Union organizer in
Las Vegas and he's great at it and he loves it. In theory I
would like to do something like that, but I wouldn't be any good
at it. This is what I'm good at.
What is the most memorable or poignant moment of your career.
You know, I specifically and clearly remember the first time
someone came up to me and conveyed one of those
you-changed-my-life moments to me. It was actually a Secret
Stars show at Bard College in New York, and I'd just gone
along for the ride. At the show this guy came up to me and he
was talking about the Chisel record 8 AM All Day and it
was my first experience with anyone who was like... like more
than a fan in just a "hey, good show" kind of way. He
went in depth about the problems in his live around the time the
record came out and how much listening to it had helped him. I,
like everyone, had gone through that with other records myself
in the past, and continue to this day. So it was definitely
like, if I had to quit all this tomorrow I would know that I had
completed that circle, and that it would all be worth it.
Do you ever consider that kind of reaction when writing a
song?
Normally when I consider reactions when I'm writing it is more
along the lines of are people going to think this is stupid?
Are people going to like this? Because I guess I'm enough of
a music fan myself that if I hit on something that is
questionable, and it seems questionable to me, that I'll know it
won't work and I'll move on.
Is there anything specific that has gone through that process
and then, after analysis, you've decided to leave out?
I can't think of anything specific off hand, but I guarantee it
happens in the course of every song. Generally lyrics come to me
in a burst. I'll have a lot of musical ideas that are waiting
for lyrics and they'll all come at the same time, but even in
that burst there isn't anything that I won't eventually go back
and have to rework or cut out.
You're going to be on the road for over half of 2001. What do
you do when you're not touring or recording?
Well, to be totally honest, the bulk of the four months of the
past year that I haven't been recording or touring... To be
completely honest I'm always writing. I'm never NOT thinking
about music. Apart from actual vacation style leisure time,
which I did try to take this year, I'm always working on music.
I mean, I kind of made it a point to not have a job this year,
because I was so busy with the record, and I guess I just spend
my days doing whatever comes up. If someone needs help moving or
whatever, I'll do that, but otherwise I'm thinking about music.
I love doing that, but I always end up racking up a huge
debt.
Don't think I'm not racking up a huge debt, because believe me,
I am.
What do you see this record doing? What do you think it can
do?
I don't know. It's been out for two months and it's doing well,
but it isn't totally blowing up. And I don't know how I would
really want it to do, and I'm kind of taking each step as it
comes. Like, MTV Road Rules wanted
to use some songs from it, and I was like... uh, No. But then
some punk BMX guy was making a video and wanted to use some
songs from it and I thought that was okay. It's a bit strange
because I'm still kind of defining my own boundaries with it. I
don't have any sense of what will come down the pipe for me to
deal with, and I also don't know how I'll deal with whatever
comes down the pipe.
We obviously think that our ideals are our ideals, and that
is that, but everything always changes. MTV is a pretty easy
example to say NO to, but if something that wasn't so obviously
tacky and yuppie. Like what if Burton Snowboards wanted to use
some of your stuff?
I don't know. It's sticky sometimes. I've been pretty vocal in
my past about not supporting or dealing with the corporate
sector. And I'm pleased to report that I think after all these
years, having changed as a person, that I still feel the same
way. But I certainly didn't always feel that way myself. There
was a time when Chisel was being courted by major labels, and I
was seriously considering it. People can change and they can
change their minds, and I'll just have to deal with it as it
comes. There are a lot of gray areas, like a huge snowboard
company or something.
But no Volkswagen commercials?
No Volkswagen commercials, probably I can say that. But the
thing is with Volkswagen...
Their business isn't capitalizing on musicians.
Exactly. So, in that sense I can get my head around it. But even
then, you're still allowing them to use your hipness and
associate themselves with something that they have no
association with. But at the same time, theoretically, I don't
have any problem representing a product that I actually like. So
if Adidas wants me to prop their (looks down) SL72
sneakers, I like them so why wouldn't I?
I'm not even sure if I want to bring this up, but what if the
whole major label bid thing comes around again?
I think I pretty much have my mind made up about it. I'd be
surprised if it came around again, just because...
Yeah, I was actually surprised to hear about the MTV thing
coming around. Surely someone, somewhere at MTV doesn't have
their head up their ass and would know that Ted Leo isn't going
to be down with that.
You'd think. But then again it has been some time since my name
has been in a position to be recognizable in the industry.
Chisel broke up almost 5 years ago, and I'm sure there is a
whole new crop of people running things now. As far as my stance
on the major label thing goes, I'm much more acutely aware of my
situation with trying to "make a living" right now.
I'm older, I'm in debt, there are a lot of things that I'd like
to do soon - in the next five years - that I'm going to need
some money for. But one good thing about having done this as
long as I have at the level that I have is that I'm not on my
way down. I haven't had a big hit, signed and then fallen. I'm
used to slugging it out in the trenches and I don't think there
is any gold ring that a major label could offer me now. Unless
maybe $100 million or something where I could actually use the
money to counteract the evil I was causing by putting a record
out on their label. (laughs). There's no temptation that could
be thrown at me that I couldn't avoid at this point, assuming it
would even happen, because it hasn't.
Man, doing interviews gets tired. I'm asking the same
questions as everyone, and there are some things you can't get
away from. But is there anything that you've never been asked or
never talked about with anyone that you were surprised about?
No one ever really asks me about Chisel, or why Chisel broke up
or anything about that. In one sense it is kind of cool, because
they're asking me about my current stuff, but it is also
surprising. After Chisel broke up, I remember the first few
interviews I did I was expecting that to come up and it just
never did, which was kind of nice but also kind of weird.
Another thing is the almost universal rejection of my first
solo record. No one EVER asks me about that, which is also
nice in a way I guess, but I almost wish it would come up so
that I could defend it.
I think your first record sucked.
(laughs) Did you really?
Well, I wouldn't say sucked, exactly. It has its moments, but
I've never wanted to listen to it enough to warrant buying a
copy. I wouldn't say I liked it.
Yeah, see. People would have some really violent reactions to
it. Do you want to get into it?
Sure.
It just amazed me that people would take such personal offense
to a record. I happen to think, personally that... For one
thing, it is a record that is meant to be listened to from
beginning to end, which is kind of hard to do sometimes. I also
think that there are some very solid songs on there. It was
something that I was doing myself, when I didn't have any money,
and I didn't know what was going to happen. I didn't have a
sense of where I was going or what I was doing. Was I going to
be in a new band? Was I going to be a solo performer? And that
is what was going on in my life at the time. It is a collection
of songs that I did myself, in my basement, and that I thought
was cool enough to put out. Obviously everyone is entitled to
their own opinions about whether it is cool or not, but people
just flipped out, man.
But, especially with this new record, there will probably be
a tendency for people to dig up the old record and it'll be
interesting to see if there will be a ...
Like, a reconsideration.
Yeah. Maybe people will say, "Oh, that record was just
grossly misunderstood." And then you'll be like What the
fuck?!
I totally had a lot of involved theory about why I did that
record the way I did it, and people don't need to get into that.
If they do, that's fine, but there are actual pop songs on that
record, and I was surprised that no one picked those out of the
stew. And then I was also surprised that no one asked me about
it afterwards. I guess they just wanted to sweep it under the
rug.
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SEE ALSO > www.secretstars.com
SEE ALSO > www.lookoutrecords.com
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